Between Judaism and the Church: How Jude Was Written and Preserved

Jude stands at the crossroads of Jewish tradition and emerging Christian identity.
In this episode, we explore how the Book of Jude was composed, its use of Jewish sources, and how it was received and preserved by the early church. Perfect for Christian seekers curious about how Scripture formed within real historical communities.

🎯 What you’ll learn:

• Key historical context

• What the text meant then

• What it means now

The Bible was written within a living Jewish tradition, preserved through community practice before institutional authority.

Modern Mind, Ancient Book explores the Bible through its Jewish roots, ancient manuscripts, and historical context—helping Christian seekers understand Scripture as it was originally written and lived.

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Transcript

SPEAKER_00 0:08

Welcome to another Modern Mind Ancient Book where we're going back to move forward, refining a love for the law, the prophets, and the writings. We're continuing today our survey style, authorship, place, date, all that kind of thing. This for the book of Jude. So Jude is actually the word or the name Judas. And there's a few of them mentioned the Bible. We're gonna get into the details here in a moment. Please like, comment, subscribe, and share. We would really like to grow this community. We're calling ourselves the followers of the way. We're trying to go back and rediscover the law, prophets, the writings, so that when we read what Jesus has done, the things he said, the way he acted, uh, and in the surrounding community, we can more accurately put that together to understand that Jesus was a Jewish sage, a rabbi of the first century, and that John the Baptist was an Essen, or as they called themselves, the Yachad. And, you know, they had separated themselves out. They believed that the king was coming, and Jesus was the one who baptized the king. So that being said, let's get to the book of Jude. My name is Roger, I'll be your host. We've got with us today a special guest again, Chip.

SPEAKER_01 1:26

Hey, good to be here, man.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

Yeah, welcome. Good morning. Yeah, thank you for being here.

SPEAKER_01 1:30

Good evening, or whatever it is out there in the land.

SPEAKER_00 1:32

That's right. Okay, so um the the book's named after the author, obviously. So Judas was a common name that was made popular because of the heroic battles of Judas Maccabees. The Maccabeans. Yeah, which we've shared, you know, uh now on the podcast recently. If you'd like to go back, you can. There's a whole thing about the Maccabean Revolt, and it's tied to the feast of dedication, which Jesus celebrated, or Hanukkah, as we call it today. The Maccabean Revolt was in the second century BC, so about 200 years before this.

SPEAKER_01 2:08

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 2:10

And it led to greater freedom for the Jewish people and established temple worship in Jerusalem, freedom from Roman um emperor worship.

SPEAKER_01 2:22

Yep, the imperial cult.

SPEAKER_00 2:23

Yep. Yep, so they were they were able to carve out for themselves this unique ability to have their own style of worship, particularly because of the greatness of the temple and the violence and madness of Antiochus, a Seleucid king.

SPEAKER_01 2:41

Yeah, and the and the all the fratricide that happened to get rid of him. That was brother on brother, not good stuff.

SPEAKER_00 2:47

Civil war, yeah. So, you know, Israel, uh Israel, for the discerning, you know, reader or listener might start to understand they're they're a warrior nation.

SPEAKER_01 2:59

Yeah, they are.

SPEAKER_00 3:00

Yeah, Israel is not a slouch of a people. Nope. By any means.

SPEAKER_01 3:04

No, they're tough.

SPEAKER_00 3:05

They have fought their way for millennia now to maintain.

SPEAKER_01 3:10

Well, it's about 3,500 years, actually. Absolutely. Isn't that about right?

SPEAKER_00 3:13

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 3:14

Maybe a little longer than that.

SPEAKER_00 3:16

Long-storied people, um, and you know, our king, our savior, our redeemer, the one we call Christ, is from that culture. So there are two possible candidates to be identified as the author. The author introduces himself as the brother of James. So, you know, James is Hakov, Jacob, right? Yep. That the Greek name is James.

SPEAKER_01 3:41

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 3:43

So a man would normally introduce himself through his father's genealogy and or city. Since Jude or Judas chose to identify himself as the brother of James, it points out the importance, even prominence, of James in the church community community. One candidate is Judas, who is designated not from Iscariot. Ischerot. Yeah. Right? Not from Gerot. Right. So, maybe. He's mentioned as one of the twelve disciples who also called Labias or Thaddeus. The second person is Jude, who is one of the brothers of our Lord. He was the youngest or next youngest of Jesus' brothers. Both of these men have been identified with a brother by the name of James. Although the Greek construction for Jude the Apostle would best be understood as Jude, the son of James. Church history tells us a little of Jude the Apostle, but on the other hand, we know from the book of Acts and the New Testament epistle of James, that James, the brother of the Lord Jesus, held a very prominent position in the early church.

SPEAKER_01 5:00

Yeah, he seems to have been like running the short running the joint.

SPEAKER_00 5:03

Yeah, at some point. In Acts 15, he was the one who had the final word. So, you know, Peter may not have been the guy.

SPEAKER_01 5:11

Right, it's well, it's kind of hard to tell. Maybe Peter had a had a more missionary outlook and somebody had to mine the mine the core.

SPEAKER_00 5:17

Mine the local core. Yeah, mine the local core. It's you know, I think of it as a restoration of the old ways. I I think that Jesus brought back to us a way that was lost, and that's why you see the community uh really begin to change to look more like an ancient way of life. Yep. They all came together where money wasn't the issue, but service to one another was. Right. And that's the way the old city-states were. They didn't have money, they had goods and services and abilities that they could trade and barter with one another.

SPEAKER_01 5:46

And long history, yep.

SPEAKER_00 5:48

And thousands of years of that before kings. Yep. Right.

SPEAKER_01 5:52

So um so one of the interesting things about Judas, if we're talking about the brother of James, who is the half-brother of Jesus, then that would make Judas the half-brother of Jesus. That's right. And I can't remember where it is, and I think it's in Matthew or or one of those where Jesus basically tells the crowd early on in his ministry that his brothers, remember, they come, they they weren't exactly believers at the time. Yeah. So I wonder if Judas got his his Christianity from James. I mean, yeah, they're you know, it seems like he might not have become a uh a follower of the way until after Jesus was crucified. Yeah, there's a not a believer.

SPEAKER_00 6:32

That's right. There's a point when, you know, Jesus' brother or Jesus' family comes and they're looking for him, and he says, Who is my family? Right, you are my family, yeah. Right. But the ones who followed.

SPEAKER_01 6:42

Not my brothers outside, but y'all are my family.

SPEAKER_00 6:44

But that eventually changed because James, Jacob, really did become one one of the followers and one of the lead guys in the church there. So, um, you know, they they didn't believe in Jesus uh during his earthly ministry, but Jude probably participated in the family actions that criticized Jesus and suggested that he had lost his mind. He certainly would have struggled as a younger brother to follow the instructions of his older weird brother, right?

SPEAKER_01 7:14

Yeah, typical younger brother. Yeah. I've got one, I know how they are.

SPEAKER_00 7:18

Yeah, Joseph the father had passed away at some point before Jesus' ministry. And, you know, this means that Jesus took on the responsibility of the family of supporting and raising the family, being the oldest son. Judas probably converted after the resurrection of Jesus, and Jesus appeared to James.

SPEAKER_01 7:40

That would be very, very convincing, also. A lot, I think, you know, all the eyewitnesses of the resurrection. Judas probably, if he wasn't one, his brother, his, you know, well, the man's the man he loved appeared. Yeah, after he was crucified.

SPEAKER_00 7:55

Yeah, and then he said, Oh my goodness.

SPEAKER_01 7:56

Yeah, well, who wouldn't?

SPEAKER_00 7:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 7:58

I'd not even imagine how you couldn't.

SPEAKER_00 8:02

They all became followers, you know. Yep. So it mean it may be that James had the privilege of leading Jude to the saving knowledge of Jesus. Hexippius, an early church father, relates that Jude was an evangelist who traveled extensively. 1 Corinthians 9 5 indicates that he was married and therefore probably had children. All Jewish men get married. Yep. Right? Yep. Have children. Yep. So, you know, this is a Jewish writer. So what we've done is we've gone kind of back and forth at this point. We started with James, the very, very Jewish brother of Jesus, who was known to spend significant time in the actual temple, and was respected by all the authorities, even though they ended up murdering him and the people. Because he was, you know, a problem for them. Right. Um, after that, you get all the way to Philemon before you see any leadership in the church that's not Jewish.

SPEAKER_01 9:03

Right.

SPEAKER_00 9:03

But that leadership, Philemon, he was basically being strong-armed to give up his Greek ways.

SPEAKER_01 9:10

Right. So at the time, I mean, the this was a concept, even the Pharisees and even the Roman authorities, this was the sect of the Nazarene. Yeah. Just another Jewish sect.

SPEAKER_00 9:18

Another Jewish sect.

SPEAKER_01 9:20

Not a faith, but a a branch of Judaism.

SPEAKER_00 9:23

They called themselves the way. Yep. And that's why, you know, that's why this program, I'm I'm trying to, you know, bring that back, not to restore what was, because we can't go back until Jesus comes back. Exactly. Right? But we do have to go back to prepare for his coming. Yes, we do. That's right, we're going back to the world.

SPEAKER_01 9:39

And that's why this book was very timely for me as a new believer, because of all of the stuff that's going on. I mean, I'm talking about inner Christian denominational fighting. I mean, this we'll get into it, but this was just a very interesting, timely, timely uh message for me.

SPEAKER_00 9:54

Yeah, well, because it's all about guard the faith, right?

SPEAKER_01 9:56

Yep, sure is.

SPEAKER_00 9:57

So, you know, the date of the book of Job is connected with its relationship to the writing of 2 Peter, since they are significantly similar. That's interesting, huh?

SPEAKER_01 10:08

Yeah, it is interesting.

SPEAKER_00 10:09

Yeah, well, is it could it be because they're both leaders in the Jerusalem church? It could be.

SPEAKER_01 10:14

And this is probably right before the time that had to be before the fall of the temple. So we're in the second temple period from a Jewish perspective.

SPEAKER_00 10:20

Yeah, they're still these these are Messianic, if you want to call them that, which just means Christian, Jewish men. Right. And they had obviously shared theology. So Jude was certainly written during the apostolic age, since the readers had personally heard the preaching of the apostles. The fact that Jude does not mention the fall of Jerusalem is one of the many examples of God's judicial destruction, indicates that he wrote it slightly before. Probably so.

SPEAKER_01 10:50

He would have mentioned it.

SPEAKER_00 10:52

Arguments for the priority of Jude are 2 Peter is longer and therefore an expansion of Jude. The tone of Jude is more confrontational and polemic, which Peter tones down when he wrote his epistle. And Peter cited information from Jude, such as the reference to angels in chapter 2, verse 11, but was dependent on the readers knowing the fuller explanation, which is given in Jude. Now, Jude is one of those ones that has a little bit of mysticism in it. Right. And you know, it takes a little study, but Jude is interesting for that reason because you get Second Temple Period theology.

SPEAKER_01 11:31

Right.

SPEAKER_00 11:32

Right? Yep. And so you know, if if you do any study of the Second Temple period, you're gonna recognize Jude in some books outside of what we call a canon. And that's really worth doing. And we're gonna talk more about it when we come back through in a few years to these parts. That's right. So the book of Jude contains many quotes, unlike 2 Peter, it would have been natural for Jude to depend on the writing of an apostle. So he wasn't Peter. He's a secondary source, not a primary source, right? So Jude seems to be under greater urgency to write to a specific situation rather than a general warning. Jude gives commands on how to deal with false teachers and wicked men. Now, what were they dealing with in Jerusalem?

SPEAKER_01 12:19

A whole bunch of controversy about what the what the correct way to worship was.

SPEAKER_00 12:23

That's right, which is all about Acts 15.

SPEAKER_01 12:25

And they were under the pressure of the Roman authorities, and it was getting worse and worse.

SPEAKER_00 12:28

You had the zealots in act in action here and a number a number of rabbis, of probably Pharisees, right? Mm-hmm. They had also converted.

SPEAKER_01 12:39

Right. And you've got this basically the the way I view all this as a as a newbie is you've got the hub in Jerusalem, and we're starting to plant churches across the eastern portions of the Roman Empire while this is going on before the fall of the temple.

SPEAKER_00 12:52

Yeah, which is interesting. Yeah, these Jewish people are looking out there going, This thing is growing among pagans.

SPEAKER_01 12:58

Right, and there are Jewish communities in all of these locations too. And that's why I wonder, you know, Judas seems like he's putting out a fire. He's definitely putting out a fire.

SPEAKER_00 13:12

I think it I think it I think it really ties to Acts 15. You know, I the the the major issue concerning the church in the day, these called out ones, is what do you do with these pagan people that know nothing of what we know, that eat pig and they're uncircumcised. And they're uncircumcised and they're you know having sex with all kinds of things and stuff, and you know, they are not like us. What do we do here? And so, you know, you in and the problem is so when the question comes in in uh in Acts 15 to James, what do we do? James doesn't just say these are all of the requirements, like you don't eat blood, you don't eat meat, offer sacrifice to idols, and you don't commit sexual immorality. That's not what he says. He quotes the prophets that say the law and Israel and the kingship will be restored to perfection. And you know what he says? We don't want to trouble them because we don't know what God is doing.

SPEAKER_01 14:21

Right. He does these are sheep in another pen. Yes. Which is really, really just uh one of the greatest blessings to the Gentiles ever.

SPEAKER_00 14:30

But James believed that these people would come under Torah without his intervention. And so that's why he didn't intervene in that way. He instead he said, Stop being so offensive to us.

SPEAKER_01 14:43

Right?

SPEAKER_00 14:43

Don't eat blood. Please, the life is in the blood. Don't eat blood, don't eat meat sacrificed to idols. Jewish people cannot sit at your table if you're doing that, and don't just sleep with everything. We don't do that, right? Right. So it was it was three basic requirements that satisfied the can we please stay united and not split apart. Right? Yep. And then the other side of that were the rabbis who were present at Jerusalem Council, and they were saying, No, you had to be circumcised, you had to practice Torah completely, you had to keep the Sabbath, you had to, right? And they're right. James said they are right, but he said they're wrong because God is doing something. We have to let this happen as it's happening.

SPEAKER_01 15:29

Let God work.

SPEAKER_00 15:30

We can't intervene in this. The prophets said it'll be, have faith it will be. So that's one of the things that we have to get right about the Jerusalem Council. It's not saying the law is nothing, it's saying God will make the law prominent and we're gonna make space for people that we never thought could come in.

SPEAKER_01 15:51

But God said they could.

SPEAKER_00 15:52

But God's doing it. But God. Yeah. But God. That's right. See, James was discerning.

SPEAKER_01 15:57

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 15:57

And so, you know, this is what I think Jude is about. I think Jude, though, isn't fighting the Gentile way. I think he's saying, hey, we have to continue to let this space be. We have to remember that Jewishness is still really important, but guys, you can't undo what God is doing. You have to guard the faith that Jesus gave us that has opened the way to these people. Don't become too stuck on yourself. This was about the root not becoming arrogant toward the branch. That's what I believe Jude is about.

SPEAKER_01 16:32

I think so too. And also there's, you know, the way I read this is he's also dealing with an and I don't know what the instance is, but he's it sounds like he's dealing with a specific problem of false teaching. Yeah. And it's not just, you know, I don't know whether the context is false Judaism or false teaching of the way. And it the communication problem.

SPEAKER_00 16:54

It's the infiltration of the Judaism that Jesus fought against. Right. It's the infiltration of authoritarian, um fear-based, uh Babylonian-inspired. And the temple is still functioning at this time, that's right. And so these authorities are now creeping in. Right.

SPEAKER_01 17:16

So we still have the Sanhedrin also in operation. That's what he's fighting for.

SPEAKER_00 17:20

Yeah. Yeah. And I apologize. It's not the root uh not being arrogant against the branch, it's the natural branches being arrogant against the engrafted branches. That's that's what I meant to say earlier. So the epistle gives us no uh geographical or ethnic designation. I don't think we need it. I think it's pretty obvious. It's pretty obvious Jewish, right? So there must certainly have been uh Jews among the readers since Jude himself identifies in relationship to James, the leader of the Jerusalem church, and the fact that he quotes from sources. So this is just being real mild about it. Right. More than likely, this was written to the people in Jerusalem and the surrounding synagogues, you know, as as much as Paul was dealing with how do I teach and lead these former pagans amongst the Jewish people and and how do I stop them from just eating each other? Um, these guys are saying, hey, you know, you Jewish people, quit going out there and making it a problem. Like, this is not a problem. God has done it.

SPEAKER_01 18:23

Right. And it's probably, Roger, it's also probably disorganized. So for example, you have this person going out and saying you have to do this. Well, that's exactly what you have another person going somewhere else and saying you have to do this, and then when they compare notes via the long process of the shipping route or whatever it's like.

SPEAKER_00 18:38

This is the true council of Nicaea or whatever, right? Exactly. It sounds like it doesn't. Yeah. So this is they're they're working out the um, they're working out the way that each and everyone is going to interact with one another. Yep. And if we're honest, this really did take a miracle to work.

SPEAKER_01 18:53

It did. Well, this is all about faith.

SPEAKER_00 18:55

Yeah. Because you're asking people who um, you know, at some point were being flayed and you know, for pork and stuff like that to now just kind of be permissive.

SPEAKER_01 19:06

Right. And we're dealing with basically first and maybe second generation followers of the way.

SPEAKER_00 19:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:10

Because in this period of time, we're about 30 years after Jesus was crucified.

SPEAKER_00 19:14

Yeah, that's right.

SPEAKER_01 19:14

So, I mean, there are there are men walking the earth that are eyewitnesses and apostles.

SPEAKER_00 19:18

Well, we we've talked about this a number of times, like the cup of trembling things. Well, during this time in 67, 68, Nero.

SPEAKER_01 19:27

Yeah, this is when this is when Paul was crucified. Paul got his head cut off.

SPEAKER_00 19:30

Yeah, no, no, Peter was crucified. Peter, that's what I meant, Peter. Paul got his head cut off. Right. This all happening right now.

SPEAKER_01 19:36

Right, and Peter was crucified, what, 64, 65, about four or five years before the temple fell.

SPEAKER_00 19:41

All these people are in the midst of chaos. And so, you know, and you can understand that when you're when you're going through a hard time, you want to really draw in. Right. Right. And and so it's it's just a chaotic time, it's a time of great distress.

SPEAKER_01 19:57

Right. And so as a new believer at the time. I would be trying to figure out what is the right way what is the way. Yeah. What is the way? What's the right way?

SPEAKER_00 20:06

A guy like you, um, a Jewish rabbi might grasp on and say, Well, you need to be circumcised. We gotta get you doing the Sabbath. And, you know, and to the listener, listen, I also want you to celebrate the Sabbath, but not as a matter of salvation, as a matter of sanctification. Yeah. As a matter of finding gratefulness and remembrance every week, because it's about creation, not about your ethnicity. God created all men. So, yeah, I mean, yeah, that that's that's how you have to do this. You have to imagine this as you're during that time, you're going through these things in this second generation church leader. And why a second generation church leader? Because James is dead. Peter's dead, Paul is dead.

SPEAKER_01 20:55

Yep. And the the eyewitnesses are are slowly or have already expired.

SPEAKER_00 21:00

And Rome is about to descend.

SPEAKER_01 21:02

Yeah, it's got man, I can't even imagine what the actual city of Jerusalem would have been like at this time. You've also got the zealots moving around.

SPEAKER_00 21:09

I mean, it was there was an uprising during this time as well.

SPEAKER_01 21:13

Yeah, the revolt. And the Romans are gathering their resources to cap to salt the earth, so to speak.

SPEAKER_00 21:19

I say this often on this show. Like I in the past, I said you could write a thousand-page report on Philemon. It's four chapters, right? Right? But you could. And so, you know, Jude is the same way. Biblical um academic desire requires you to be interdisciplinary. You have to be a historian, you have to be a linguist, you have to understand languages, you have to understand sociology, you have to understand um ancient languages, reading, writing, speaking. Like it it is literally, you have to be an archaeologist. You know, and so it's it's all these interdisciplinary teams that bring this stuff together. But the thing is, is to get this right, you've got to be somewhat well educated to put all the pieces in their place. You do, right? And so, you know, if we shut off our TVs and our phones and read more books, we might understand what we're doing.

SPEAKER_01 22:17

That's what I was gonna say. It's all right there in the Bible.

SPEAKER_00 22:19

Yeah. Literally, yeah, it's all right there. And it'll point you to the places you need to be. Yep. Right? Like if you wanna if you wanna understand who Jude was and what the environment was, then you know, get the Josephus War book, right? Yep. And see what it was like because I promise you, this was a very, very dark time. And you can read the actual historical account of it. Um, if you want to know what the surrounding thing was and why Jude had this like angel stuff in there, there's all this stuff on Second Temple Judaism that you can read about. Yep. Or even better, listen to it on Audible or whatever, right? That's what I do. I do a lot of audible books. So, you know, we we have to entertain ourselves with the things of heaven. We do, not I don't know, stranger things or whatever.

SPEAKER_01 23:05

It's really probably difficult for the listener in in 21st century, the 21st century electronic world to be able to shut things off and step out and meditate and get into the word, but that is actually a that that is a path to peace. I'm I'm I'm here to testify to that.

SPEAKER_00 23:23

Yeah, it's true. And and for me, you know, I'm immersed in in all this technology because this is what I'm doing as a way to reach out to the world. That being said, I I promise you, you know, and this is for you, listener. I'm telling you today, if you would learn to make your entertainment driven on learning more about the thing that you love, about Jesus, about the Bible, about the future world, about the past world. It's quite entertaining. There's, you know, reading books, listening to things, watching documentaries, just whatever it takes. Um, you know, that that will lead you closer to a greater understanding. It says, My people perish for lack of knowledge. It's up to you to get that knowledge. And it's easy to do. Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 24:12

That's the thing. All you have to do is have a little bit of time and and you have to pursue, you have to seek.

SPEAKER_00 24:17

You can do one of two things. You can do nothing or you can do something. And today's a great day to do something. So you want to read the book of Jude, that you're a new believer in Jesus Christ, you know that you've been called by God, and you know that God loves you, and that Jesus will keep you safe. Cup of Trembling. Cup of Trembling. Your Christian community has been infiltrated by false teachers. These are people who you admired before, but are now teaching strange things that contradict what you know about the truth of God. And I'm gonna say this the Jerusalem church began to fall to the pressures of Judaism. That's what was happening. They were losing their freedom in Christ. You have listened to these people teach you in the past, but in your spirit, the spirit is telling you that something's not right. They slander celestial beings, they sp their speech has become hard and abusive. They have the impearance of religion, but their actions, so wickedness and immorality. And if you know about this period, that's exactly what was happening. Violence was becoming the way of Jerusalem because they were about to clash with Rome, and Rome was about to utterly wipe them out. Yep. So, again, a warrior people. Now, do I fault these people for this? See, here's the problem. We all think we're doing the right thing. And that's why Jesus said vengeance is God's.

SPEAKER_01 25:48

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 25:49

Because once you get sucked into it, you're just in it. And you don't see clearly.

SPEAKER_01 25:52

And then you're willing to throw morality out.

SPEAKER_00 25:55

Yeah, you throw your life away. Yep. He says if you love this life, you'll lose it. You got Jesus showed us what it is. You gotta just be willing to suffer. Because this world is not the end, it's your infancy.

SPEAKER_01 26:10

Yep. That's all to me. That's it. This is all smoke and mirrors.

SPEAKER_00 26:13

Smoke and mirrors. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 26:14

I mean, though, this particular part of our existence is smoke and mirrors. It's all a part of the of what I see as a really big deception. And it seems to me like Jude was getting to the same point. You know, he's telling us to be aware of godless men and to have faith and to contend for the faith.

SPEAKER_00 26:29

Yeah, I mean, just you know, take into account how um what we do, right? Like the Bible clearly tells us not to give favors to wealthy or prominent people, but the minute somebody wealthy or prominent gets saved, we're like, oh my gosh, listen to everything they say. Right. They can be three weeks old, they know nothing.

SPEAKER_01 26:46

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 26:47

But they're on TV, getting interviewed, influencing people. Yep. You know, you're like, I mean, for me, I'm like, I you know, I've spent like 15 years doing this, and these people are like nonsensical.

SPEAKER_01 26:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:59

And I just don't want anybody to hear this, but I can't stop it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 27:05

So Jude, there's a lot of judgment, uh warnings of judgment in Jude, also. Yeah. Which I think is very prescient for the current time.

SPEAKER_00 27:12

Well, it was very, it was very important for the time he was in. Yeah. I mean, these are these are people who are about to take up their swords in a feudal way. Right. Jesus said the temple would be done. Uh-huh. You weren't gonna fight and win. This was one of those times when unfortunately, Jewish people made a mistake. It was a bad war to fight. Yep. You know, it's it it breaks my heart. We don't rejoice over the death of anybody. No. No, that's not a Christian thing. Jesus was not that. He was here to save and lead and bring to hope, not to rejoice over the death of anybody. And Jewish people are certainly not our enemy. The Book of Jude argues that they must contend earnestly for the faith against false teachers, whom the Lord will judge. The purpose of this is to exhort the believers to contend earnestly for the faith against false teachers, and to remind them that the Lord will judge the heretics.

SPEAKER_01 28:19

That's right.

SPEAKER_00 28:20

So who brings fruition? I mean, it goes right back to Acts 15 in James, right? Who brings the truth? Is it the rabbis out there pushing everybody to be circumcised? James says, no. God is doing something. Let these pagans come, they will keep the law because God said it in the prophecies. Yep. And in the same thing here, will Israel survive this? Rome is coming, the apostles are getting murdered, persecution of the there, he was burning, he was burning Christians in his garden.

SPEAKER_01 29:00

Right. You're talking about Nero? Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:02

So, you know, in Israel at this point is rising up in violence, and Jude's there going, guys, you guys are getting too hard. We we are not this. We can't. Yes, I know you hate Romans, I know you do, but they're coming to faith too. Remember, our faith is for everybody, it's for once for all. And God will bring the kingdom to us. We don't have to do this. But we did.

SPEAKER_01 29:33

Well, you know, it's if you think about somebody with their boots on the ground in Jerusalem at this time, it must have looked like the end of everything. Oh, for sure. And you know, from the perspective of 2025 AD, you know, you can see a cup of trembling on the way coming coming to the West. And it's the same sort of thing. You know, that's what I'm struck by. And there's uh there's an awful lot of false teaching going on right now, too, and it's very hard to discern as a new Christian.

SPEAKER_00 29:58

There are very depressing 40 to 45,000 denominations. We have completely lost our way.

SPEAKER_01 30:06

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 30:06

You know, I mean, this the Jude is a cry for God's got this.

SPEAKER_01 30:09

Oh, a thousand times. Because you know, if you were if you were uh inside of Jerusalem when it fell, assuming you survived.

SPEAKER_00 30:15

Well, you know, let's be real, they believed that Jesus was imminent.

SPEAKER_01 30:19

Right. And there's a isn't there a a a point of what's it, eschatology where people believe that that is already Jesus has already come. Yeah, that's right. It's called preterism. Preterism, yeah. So I'm new to all this, but yeah, so I don't I don't hold with that personally.

SPEAKER_00 30:32

Well, so so here's the thing the preterists are right, but they're wrong because they don't understand how the Bible has rolling themes.

SPEAKER_01 30:39

Right.

SPEAKER_00 30:40

Right? So you'll have this thing happen and it'll look just like it, but not really. Right?

SPEAKER_01 30:44

Not yet. And that's sort of the argument I'm making in a roundabout way. If you're actually in this time period in Jerusalem, looking around you as the world collapses, the temple's pulled down, your brothers and sisters are killed, sold off into slavery. The end has come.

SPEAKER_00 31:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 31:01

But God.

SPEAKER_00 31:02

But God. Yeah, there's Israel, Israel has to come back, the temple has to rebuild.

SPEAKER_01 31:07

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:08

And Jesus will reign as king from Jerusalem over Rome.

SPEAKER_01 31:12

Interesting.

SPEAKER_00 31:13

Yep. And you know what we ended up seeing anyways was Jesus did conquer Rome.

SPEAKER_01 31:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 31:18

It just wasn't the way we imagined. Yeah, that's a fact. Right? So, and then, but was that perfect? No.

SPEAKER_01 31:25

No, because you've got men and power. Yeah. Men and power, that's that's not a good combination.

SPEAKER_00 31:32

The king has not touched down yet. No. Yep. But he's showing us how powerful he is to save. Yep. To bring in a people, a people who don't deserve it. We can't be arrogant against the natural branches. Israel, yes, they rejected their king. But look at the church today. How many in the church ever even think about Jesus as a Jewish rabbi? As a man who loved the things of the first century. And the law. We are so divorced from him.

SPEAKER_01 32:11

We are. Well, some of us are.

SPEAKER_00 32:14

Yeah. You know, and look, I'm not saying the church is going to hell. I'm saying read Revelation about what Jesus says to the churches.

SPEAKER_01 32:22

I can't wait till we get to Revelation.

SPEAKER_00 32:23

And tremble a bit because what he says is that the churches are not in a good state, but yet we are not broken in saffcloth and repentance and changing. Instead, we're digging in our heels.

SPEAKER_01 32:40

Individually, we have not been forsaken.

SPEAKER_00 32:42

Yes. Jesus is so kind. Like there are people going to be in heaven I could never imagine. I might not be there. Although I know I will be because Jesus is really good. Yeah. Yeah. But the thing is, is you know, I'm not judging. What I am saying is, I don't want you to be judged. So not right knowledge, but loving the Jewish sage and what he loved is to do his works. And he said to do his works.

SPEAKER_01 33:13

Yep.

SPEAKER_00 33:14

The key verse is, dear friends, although I was very eager to write you about the salvation we share, I felt I had to write you and urge you to contend for the faith that was once for all entrusted to the saints. And that's what I think we're doing today. So for me, I am contending for the faith that was delivered to the saints, meaning this. It was delivered to a Jewish people in the first century, and they went out with proselytes and they began to preach and teach, and pagans came in, and they were supposed to love the things that Jesus loved, but instead the church felt pagan beliefs mostly, and his name is still prominent. All you gotta do is go to the cross. That's where your salvation is. But that's not the end, that's the beginning.

SPEAKER_01 34:00

That's a fact.

SPEAKER_00 34:01

From there you grow and you become more and more like Jesus, and you go out in the world and you tell them who he truly was so that they too might be saved.

SPEAKER_01 34:11

Amen.

SPEAKER_00 34:11

Thanks for joining us today. Uh, we hope that you've enjoyed this. Please again like, comment, subscribe, and share. Modernmindancientbook.org. That's the website. We'd really appreciate it if you would go on there, explore around, uh, share that also with people, and uh, we wish you the best. Chip, shalom. Shalom. Shalom.

SPEAKER_01 34:30

God bless you.

SPEAKER_00 34:30

Bye bye.